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Sony A7 and A7r , FF gems, like GH3 but FF
  • 261 Replies sorted by
  • sohussohus

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev

    I am just saying that all the announced lenses are 1 stop slower than you would expect. A 24-70 F/4 is a B lens, the F/2.8 is what the professional photographer wants (look at other systems). For the 35mm, you would expect F/1.8 or F/2. Of course, full-frame has some advantages in terms of light gathering. And adapters are nice, but what's the use of this camera with a massive huge bulky lens? I would rather buy a D800E then.

    I like where Sony is going but rather wait till 2015. Prices will come down and better lens choices will be available.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    And adapters are nice, but what's the use of this camera with a massive huge bulky lens? I would rather buy a D800E then.

    Because you can't do same on D800E, mirrorless is much better suited to work with old manual glass (shorter flange distance, zooming and peaking, EVF, metering, etc). And drop this "massive huge bulky" thing. It is same full frame lenses with same size and very similar weight.

  • joe1946joe1946

    The D800E with lens will never look as small as the 36MP A7r with lens.

    Sony-a7r-HAND.jpg
    1024 x 472 - 150K
    Sony-A7-with-28-70mm-lens-hand.jpg
    450 x 450 - 18K
  • TronTron

    @sohus I'm of the same opinion here, the glass is really holding back the seriousness of this tool. New adopters of this system would be crazy to go out and buy crop glass as a bridge for autofocus use (existing Nex users who already have glass investments make much more sense). That being said, once the lens system is in place this camera will be a no-brainer for stills photography use, it's a real technical marvel. Maybe Sigma will deliver fast, affordable FF mirrorless glass down the road. I could justify buying this for video if it wasn't a soft, moire machine as posted by The Camera Store, that's definitely a letdown.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Some samples:

  • fotosiamofotosiamo

    That's what I'm talking about! Wow, the detail and from a Jpeg, too!

    http://timg.eprice.com.hk/hk/dc/img/2013-10/16/3951/alexchow_5_Sony-_158f02c585ec4934917e4ed09767362bori.JPG

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

  • flabloflablo

    But ... am I the only one that after watching the Sony sample footage Youtube video (the one published by Vitaliy in page 1 of this thread) thinks that it looks terrible?

  • TscheckoffTscheckoff

    @flablo: No. It´s not only you. ^^ Btw.: Also moire seems to be an issue - even with the Alpha 7. (At least with the actual pre-production firmware.) So -> Nice concept. But not very interesting for video shooters (at least at the actual state). The RX10 seems to be way more interesting. Fixed lens BUT it scales the whole image down to the Full-HD resolutin (like the GH2 / GH3 for example). So it SHOULD be way less prone to flare (and also the details / resolution should be on a very high level because of this).

  • Brian202020Brian202020

    @Tscheckoff

    The GH2 and GH3 do not scale the entire image down like the RX10.

  • TscheckoffTscheckoff

    @Brian202020:

    Ok. "Mea culpa" ^^. 100% correct: It scales the 16:9 sensor area down. So: No line skipping is the case.

  • Brian202020Brian202020

    @Tscheckoff

    You are misunderstanding me. No they do not. It uses a process called pixel binning. The GH2 and GH3 sensors are not capable of a steady 60 fps which would be required for what you are saying.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @Brian202020

    How it is all related to A7 topic? Especially considering that it is quite inaccurate.

    It uses a process called pixel binning. The GH2 and GH3 sensors are not capable of a steady 60 fps which would be required for what you are saying.

    This is quite inaccurate words. As pixel binning is.. scaling. Just simple variation of one. On GH2 it is done using on sensor logic as far as I know. As it is clear from tests GH3 also uses similar technique, but some moire can come from changed sensor resolution and some different logic.

    If you carefully look at the description, it seems that Sony is using similar technique as they tell about some special preprocessing stage in main LSI. And with big probability it is.. pixel binning on raw stage. :-)

  • TscheckoffTscheckoff

    @Brian202020: Oh. That you meant. Sorry. Misunderstood - yes. (Btw.: I always thought that it´s scaling it down. Good to know it´s not. Thx for the info.)

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev: Sorry for a little bit off topic ^^.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    SonyAlpharumors provided link to archive with raw photos

    https://www.wetransfer.com/downloads/7508c4aee8931a4d44f3bb3f23ac8fbd20131018142351/9c05720becf33180b91acb47339a393020131018142351/a95501

  • ZazZaz

    IQ so disappointing. Has there been any 422 hdmi capture released anywhere?

    Crazy how in touch the marketing has been with these cameras. That plus such a spot on feature-set made me feel like we were finally gonna get what we've been asking for. Then poop image quality. :( Insane!!

    Anyone else holding out hope for the HDMI out?

  • hoodlumhoodlum

    HDMI out will not resolve moire issues.

  • fotosiamofotosiamo

    I felt the same way with the Sony a99 in regards to initial IQ, then I did a week-long review and was convinced that the images are up to par w/ the Canikon full-frames. I'm going to review the a7/a7R in a couple of weeks when I go to Nashville w/ Sony for one week.

    Any suggestions/requests?

  • MimirsanMimirsan

    Guys can we keep a bit of perspective here? Why is it every fucking STILLS camera that gets a release have to be judged solely on its video mode??? Its sure smells of reid mentality. Its really becoming tiresome to read these comments on every new photocentric camera release.

    Besides why you would ever want to use a a7 for filmmaking work/videowork is beyond me. There are plenty of better options available. As a full frame photography camera that you can use legacy glass on? Its pretty awesome.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Guys can we keep a bit of perspective here? Why is it every fucking STILLS camera that gets a release have to be judged solely on its video mode???

    because most of the members here shoot videos :-)

    Besides why you would ever want to use a a7 for filmmaking work/videowork is beyond me. There are plenty of better options available.

    Such as? What exactly are better options among FF cameras? With good EVF, small flange distance?

  • apefosapefos

    lots of moire in A7:

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @apefos

    It's a Sony! (c)

  • IrondiverIrondiver

    The moire seen in the video, is it typical of sony based chips? Is it far worse than seen on say Panny GH3 or BMCC Pocket? The reason I asked is that I am currently working (playing with my hacked GF2. It is more than sufficient for learning, my upgrade path will either be a Pocket Cinema or GH3. For reasons that Vitaliy mentioned I didn't want to go FF (EVF and flange distance etc). Size didn't matter to me before as professional Photog years back I carried Nikon F3 and F4 and several more pounds of glass. But now smaller is fine.

    Along come Sony offering something that's looks quite reasonable. In my heart I love FF, a 50mm is a 50mm. But I'll stay with MFT if video quality is arguably better. I am partial to GH3 but want the ProRes of BMC Pocket. With GH3 going down in price, a Atomos Ninja can fix that.

  • DrDaveDrDave

    If you don't want moiree and aliasing, get a TM700 or one of the Pro CMOS Canon camcorders. Unfortunately, most manufacturers really don't care whether lines are straight or curved or staircase.

  • IrondiverIrondiver

    Been there, I bought the TM700 loved it, 60P was smooth, but I wanted shallower depth of field without having to use adapters (remember Letus) Sold it and bought the gf2 when the hack was developed. Now I am looking for another step up, I am not in any particular hurry, still learning. I was interested in the BMC pocket, but 3x crop, no evf, no tilt screen. Now the videos samples that I have seen, are dreamy. It's selling point is it's image and portability, but my gf2 can do great things outside and even with evf attached can fit in my cargo pocket or man bag.

    The Panny GH3 has many of the things the BMCp doesn't have, and to be honest the footage that I have seen from GH2/GH3 still leave me speechless. But I would like to have the higher bitrate of ProRes HQ for this greenscreen stuff on this Steam/Diesel Punk shorts I am developing. I know that with clean HDMI the Atomos Ninja can give good ProRes.

    Now ( as I try to bring this tangent back on topic) Sony Releases the A7, looks very promising. First off I am fairly brand neutral all these things are just tool ( I stuck with nikon because it says a lot that even even the most modern dslr can be fitted out with a 40 year old lens). The A7 offers high quality stills, tiltable lcd, quality evf, etc. But the new twist is FF, I was fascinated.

    Question ( yes there is a question in all this sermonizing, sorry) These sample test footage, what little there is, Is it all pre-production? Is there hope that some of this aliasing could be controlled before shipping day?

    If I were still a paid Pro, I might still consider it for a full frame still camera, loud shutter and all. I'll continue to read what people post here and follow along. In the meantime continue to work on the script and shooting techniques.

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