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GH1 Stable 24p Setting
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  • MrAnthonyMrAnthony
    Okay, so I ran off the BestBuy to get a Sandisk 30 MB/sec Extreme card to test out the original hack. It still crashes, this time somewhere between 1:15 seconds and 1:30 after start of recording. Even underexposure by a full stop doesn't keep it from crashing. This is just not a good hack for bright outdoor light with lots of detail and small movement, like foliage in a breeze. I'll have to do more testing with artificial indoor lighting, but it was definitely more stable in that setting. Thanks for giving me some hope--I really would like to find a good outdoor 24P hack for the GH1, but will probably have to just get used to using the GH2, which seems to have a much better codec. Indoors, I have been using LPowells 100Mbps 24P hack, which is very stable except under the same conditions which crash your hack.
  • MrAnthonyMrAnthony
    And just for comparison, the LPowell 100 Mbps hack crashes after 10 seconds of the same scene, even with a stop of underexposure, so your hack seems more stable, although I haven't been able to compare quality between the two hacks.
  • rigsrigs
    1:15 seconds and 1:30 of foliage is probably more than most can stand to view as well as the camera.

    I'm not sure how it compares in quality to LPowell's 100 Mbps hack, I'm pleased with the results so far. This one imports into Avid perfectly where with other patches I have had some trouble with +50Mbps files needing to be transcoded first, which is a step I would rather avoid. We have been using GH1 and GH2 for broadcast work for the past year and prefer the GH1 because it has less of a grainy look to it compared to the GH2. I have been playing with various GH2 patches and it does show an improvement in macroblocks but the overall image is still to detailed and grainy for my liking. I wish Vitality will continue to help improve the Ptools for the GH1 and add in some of the tweaks only available for the GH2. Perhaps this will lead to an improved 24p patch for all.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    Sad to hear the Sandisk crashed MrAnthony--thanks for testing. I already ordered my Sandisk, I guess I'll keep it if it gives a slight improvement. Would be interesting to try the 45 MB/sec version that is just out but I can't buy another flash card right now.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    Blues is reporting stable 6 GOP after bumping up the video buffer to 84,000,000
    Hoping we are close to rock solid, great IQ in low light and smooth panning in GH1 at 24p native
  • DrDaveDrDave
    WooHoo! Keeping GOP at 12 and bumping up the video buffer to 84,000,000 I recorded *native 24p* with a 50mm macro at F/5.6 the Shrub of Doom to my cheapo Transcend Class 10 card for two minutes, and regular outdoors stuff for longer. Up till now, the Shrub of Doom ate anything that came near it. Thanks to Rigs and Blues, will test further.
  • julesjules
    @DrDave Do you have a link to Blues's settings? Same as OP but with the 84 change?
  • bluesblues
    just tested the rigs patch set at gop3 and buffer at maximum....its looking good and giving me bitrates of 40mbps outdoors, am using carl zeiss G lens blogon 28mm 2.8 with ISO at 1600....when tested with Canon 50mm fd 1.4 the bitrate drop to 30mbps average
  • rigsrigs
    Higher bit rates are nice but do they really add to better overall quality at that rate? I had used a 3 gop version of this patch on a 28 day shoot in June with 2 GH1 cameras and a GH2. These where all exterior scenes. Though we only had 2 crashes, I did have some problems with higher bit rates not importing into Avid and had to transcode those clips. Some even had a hard time transcoding to DNxHD 175. Stange that they all played back fine in camera and on my PC via Splashlite.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    @jules--just change the 84
  • tinbeotinbeo
    @rigs : I also edit with avid, so frustrated with importing problems into avid. Ya know what I mean? It showed error and stopped, wasting lots of time.
  • rigsrigs
    I hear ya Tinbeo. I had a handful of them not importing each night on my last production. Seemed like Avid didn't like to import anything over 50Mbps, no matter what the length of the clip was. It was a pain I had to endure for 28 days. The footage still worked in the end, it just meant keeping an eye on the batch imports and transcoding the ones that crashed.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    Rocks on Premiere Pro---even interlaced.
    So far, the low light grain looks really great, prefer ISO 800 to GH2 (prefer 1600 on the GH2)
    And leaves waving in the wind at ISO 100--which I don't shoot that often--looks amazingly smooth, detailed and judder free.
  • bluesblues
    there is no doubt that the rigs patch is king of Gh13 for low light situation...even at gop3, it plays back in any situation. I have gone thru complicated detail shots outdoors and it performs without crashes.Lets try look into other function of the latest ptool so we can calibrate it further by tweaking the other settings
  • telkitachkitelkitachki
    @blues What benefits does this patch providing at low light situation? What reason to stop using @LPowell s patches and start using this patch?
  • DrDaveDrDave
    I've only been trying it for a few days, but it is very smooth, very detailed and more stable. It will file span fairly reliably on my GH13 with the 84 bump. I suggest you try it and see for yourself. I happen to really like it outdoors, except for bleached grass etc.
  • blah_dogsblah_dogs
    Are these settings when bumped to 84 running stable at 3 and 6 gop? If they are...which is able to span? I would love to be testing for myself but i am still waiting on lenses to get here.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    On my cam, GOP 12 is more stable, but I am still waiting for my new Sandisk card
  • DrDaveDrDave
    Received my Sandisk 32 gb 30Mb/sec "HD Video" card today, but, alas, will not pass the grass test. Crashes around the same time as the Transcend. Still good indoors, and it is a good patch, just not crash proof.
  • havasuvideohavasuvideo
    I had two of the same cards, and when tested, they didn't do much better than my Kingston Class 4, so I sent them back for a refund.
    I still have one of the original Extreme III 16gb 30mb/sec cards, and it does do that speed on tests. The "HD video" cards tested at 20.90mb/sec read, and 19.41mb/sec write.
    The Extreme III was 29.02mb/sec read, and 26.26mb/sec write. The Kingston Class 4 was 20.90mb/sec read, and 12.28mb/sec write. YMMV

    I get zero errors with my Extreme III card in all modes, but I haven't a clue as to what you guys are changing(GOP-Buffer), and why??

    Can you spell out the changes you made in the settings to get a GOP of 3, or 6?? Is this only in FHD/24P mode, or does it also work in SH/720/60P mode??
  • rigsrigs
    @havasuvideo
    @DrDave

    The The Extreme III cards do offer a faster rate then the newer HD video versions, I find them very reliable.

    @havasuvideo
    I believe blues has only adjusted the GOP settings by changing them to GOP 6 or GOP 3 which will increase the overall bit rate and slightly improve motion detail. There are seperate ptool GOP settings for both 720 60p and 1080 24p. My original settings set to 15 GOP for 720 60p. You can adjust them to 10 or 5 for increased bit rates. As well as my original GOP setting for 1080 24p are is 12, which can be changed to 6 or 3. However I have found that these lower GOP setting do increase the bit rate but only slightly improve the overall quailty and may not be as stable in extreme detail scenes.
  • havasuvideohavasuvideo
    ok, thanks.
    I just did a back to back test between this patch, and the blackout/powell patch. using 1080/24p only, manual settings, Nikon 50mm F2.0 at F2.0 with ND400 filter, 1/50th, locked down on a tripod, with focus pulls to three places in my backyard(brightly colored stuffed animals).
    Each file, yielded an average of 26mb/sec, and neither produces any higher or lower quality, or bit-rates.
    In other words-both patches look identical when shot in a fairly high detailed scene(rocks/stuffed animals/really bright sun-exposure exactly on, then under exposed 1/3 to 2/3rd just to see if it made any difference).

    So, aside from the fact that this new patch seems to yield higher bitrates in SH(720/60P), I'm not seeing any differences.
    However, it should be noted that with the blackout/powell patch, I have to shoot 720/60P in H mode, and manually set the bit rate to 30mb/sec-any higher, or use SH mode, and it crashes.

    So, is there a "new" setting for this "new" patch, to yield higher bit rates in FHD(1080/24), while also keeping the SH(720/60) mode intact???

    Also, a bit off topic-but, for those shooting the 100mb/sec non-native 24p patch-how are you reverse telecining the file, to render it to 24P?? I'm on a PC. Same question for the 75mb/sec patch.....
  • rigsrigs
    @havasuvideo
    "So, is there a "new" setting for this "new" patch, to yield higher bit rates in FHD(1080/24), while also keeping the SH(720/60) mode intact???"

    Try changing the GOP setting for 1080 24p to 6 or 3 and see how that works for you.
  • DrDaveDrDave
    The Rigs patch works great indoors, especially for static scenes. Minimal pulsing, smooth transitions, etc. Very nice.
    I made some small changes for a "reliable indoor" patch, upping as suggested the buffer to 84, GOP 12, video bitrate between 22-36. So far I get reliable file spanning indoors at 24p, but will test further.
  • LPowellLPowell
    I tried out Rigs' GH1 24p patch on some of the most challenging scenes I've used to test my own patches. The target bitrate of this patch is set to 115Mbps, which is the highest of any stable patch that I've seen. Stream Parser, however, reports that the peak bitrate the patch can produce is over 220Mbps, very close to the maximum advertised bitrate for Sandisk Extreme 30MB/sec SD cards.

    On the most brutal tests, I did see persistent recording failures, typically after 8-12 seconds. However, in these cases the patch produced extremely dense I-frame bitrates of 9Mbits, while maintaining average bitrates below 45Mbps. This indicates that the patch should produce very high quality video images under all but the most stressful conditions.

    Here's an example of a scene that produced a corrupted MTS file after 11.5 seconds:

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