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GH2 driftwood hack in shootout with Canon C300
  • 471 Replies sorted by
  • magnificomagnifico

    What I noted in vimeo forum concerning test2 of Philip Bloom:

    " considering your tests here, I think :

    1/ c300 =(better Hardware/Sensor, average software/compressor 50mb/s mpeg2)

    2/ gh2 =( average Hardware/Sensor, better software/compressor 170mb/s H264, Vitaliy Hack)

    They are on par on resolution ! Advantage to c300 in NO light conditions, but no test needed here. If we add a post process denoising, on LOW light condition, we don’t know the limit in which gh2 is still here, but gh2 has got some arguments in his favor since it gives a lot of details in low light(because of excellent compression compared to c300) even if there is noise.

    I think c300 is a very good hardware base for canon to go on improving software on it ! Common Canon, give some open source software tools to community with this cam …"

  • RRRRRRRR

    @brianluce exactly.. when a 800$ (or less) camera performs comprably with 20k "Pro" offerings.. (real 1080p resolution is real 1080p resolution) then we really cannot complain too much about the options..

  • brianlucebrianluce

    @RRRR Yeah especially when part 2 of the test was "Oh, this camera is pretty dark, let's try this other camera, oh, it's similar, not bad but still kind of dark. Now, how about this one? Hmmm pretty dark, but that's expected..."

    And all the images looked lousy and unusable. If you have to put any of those in your film, you're in big trouble.

  • oscillianoscillian

    In a run and gun situation (ie weddings), any camera that helps me recover underexposed faces well gets my vote :) up until now I've used stock 720 50p @17mbts and hate the mush in shadow areas. I hope VK has the new ptool finished before spring here in PAL-land!

  • workerbworkerb

    I find the GH2 fanaticism really off putting & embarrassing.

  • MattMatt

    @workerb

    ditto!!!!

  • mrbillmrbill

    Nice to hear nick driftwood's patch will stand up to a lot of pushing and pulling in post. For under a grand, this camera does so much more than we've any right to expect. Can't wait for the v1.1 patches..

  • proaudio4proaudio4

    @workerb

    Also, Most of us here certainly realized that smaller sensor cameras gather LESS light at the SAME f-stop an FOV. This was a given to know that the GH2 would not beat the large sensor formats in low light.

  • PixCanFlyPixCanFly

    We are seeing more hardcore GH2 fanboy these days. Time for some prescription.

  • MimirsanMimirsan

    @workerb Ditto also. I love my GH2 but the hardcore community sucks it bigtime. All it will bring is resentment and total lack of taking them (and the GH2) seriously.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    This is ok. Until we can notice extreme fanboy things :-) And tell them to hold. We are not fanboys community here.

  • RRRRRRRR

    Well, apart from earlier in this thread on occasion, I can't really find too much fanboyism on here.. Obviously there are opinions about how the tests are conducted and the video, but that is completely normal - to be expected. It's not like Bloom attempted for a scientific approach which left out all controversy. On the contrary, the test is done on a whim and comments are made without much thought. Both from Mr Bloom and from people on here..

    Big deal. The wise man knows what to take from such information and what to ignore.

    Never before in history has there been so little points to get from brand / product loyalty and never before has there been so many options for video shooters.

    @brianluce exactly.. I found the low light test the least revealing. The skin tones test was done in a way that I would avoid whilst shooting. However, some aspects of usability really came to the forefront in all the tests and Sony seemed like the big winner there, for the different log options. However, the differences are pretty minute for many of the cameras when it comes to actual real world usage, which proves my point earlier point about brand loyalty and options.

  • danyyyeldanyyyel

    The thing about test is too stress the cameras. If he used the same lighting and lens, so the test are valid. Yes nobody is going to shoot like that but this tells us how much each camera will fare. In some way you could say that someone with a Sony f3, fs100 or C300 could shoot in those type of lighting. One thing I agree with is that the way he talks makes the gh2 as if the worst performer. For me it is definitely worst than the Sony/c300 camcorder which are exceptional but at least on par if not superior to the other dslr.

    Just to reply to some fanboyism here, if you apply the same denoise procedure to the C300 and F3 footage that you are saying for the gh2, you will also have even better images. So it does not shorten shorten the gap at all. Now it does not make the gh2 a bad camera for low light, it is just that those f2/fs100/c300 are exceptional.

  • danyyyeldanyyyel

    My conclusion of the test are

    Best bang for a buck the gh2. Exceptional value, with very high resolution, good dynamic range (better than what you see on the test) and ok/average low light. what would be really the next big thing for the hack gh2 would be a flatter profile or permanent idynamic range. The gh2 has more than the apparent DR with the hack (in the shadows) and those two above could bring some more.

    Best middle upgrade is the fs100 with an external recorder like the Ninja. Already very good resolution, seems to have very good dynamic range with the glock picture profile and exceptional low light. I think with a cheap recorder this could be a very good upgrade to the hacked gh2. It is said to have much less rolling shutter than the dslr. It is a hair less resolution, but with better DR and much better low light. In fact apart from built quality I don't find the c300 bringing anything that warrants the 3x price.

    The best for me in this test if you have the money, is the sony F3. Very good resolution and exceptional low light and dynamic range. We have been seeing it in the test with its internal codec. But with an $ 1400 Samurai 10 bit slog at 220mbits, it should be even better and I still can't understand the positioning of the C300.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @danyyyel

    I suggest to overcome obsessions with test an comparisons. it is time to move on.

  • jfrojfro

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev Although it's taken a little time from day to day, I've looked forward to reading opinions of what people think.

    I purchased one of the first 5D Mark II's that came out (about 39 months ago) and sold all my HD Video Camcorders after that for the DOF and low like features. I bought and sold a 60D, 7D, and now use 2 GH2's and the 5D.

    I'm so grateful for the work you've done and all the others, esp. on the GOP3 and 1 settings. I'm constantly amazed at the footage on the GH2 and the screen grabs for photo use.

    I'm guessing that with the GH2 there will be some small incremental improvements to the hack but another camera will come out utilizing your time for a new project. Until then, my one wish is to work on a flatter & less saturated way of shooting with the GH2 and driftwood's settings. I try to keep up reading your site, but I still don't have a clue if a flatter/less saturated profile is possible. Could you possibly give us a short explanation if this might be possible in the future.

    Thanks again for your efforts and I apologize in advance because this is probably not in the right place.

  • DrDaveDrDave

    I'd just like to mention with all the discussion about the GH2 and the C300, which is totally valid and shows the amazing sharpness of the GH2, that Philip Bloom also did another interesting shootout of the Vixia G10 (aka XA-10) http://philipbloom.net/2011/07/09/video-review-of-the-canon-xa-10-xf100-and-xf105/

    And I can tell you that for low certain types of low light shooting I slightly prefer the G10, specifically in terms of noise and aliasing. On certain types of subjects, the GH2 really has issues--flat surfaces show tons of noise, and long , narrow string items, like wires or musical strings, show stair stepping. And I mention this because I think we are really one model away from a cam that can do all things pretty well (I hope, I hope). Maybe it is the new GH3 or the new Fuji organic sensor, or maybe it is the new Canon, but I look forward to the day where the Cams catch up with the tech: we have had great LL performance for several years from Canon, and the new Pro CMOS sensor from the Canon CC division really is great on the aliasing in real world work, so put it together, guys!

    One cam to rule them all. The GH2 is great, but I am sick of the noise and the jaggies, and my G10 is great, but I want five percent more sharpness and interchangeable lenses. And for under a grand. It has to be doable now with current tech.

  • brianlucebrianluce

    @dannnyel Yeah, I think I agree. I too am a little puzzled with c300 positioning, especially now that the D4 is out. Brian (GH2 megafanboy)

  • TrackZillasTrackZillas

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev Right on VK Let's all go out and shoot..

  • proaudio4proaudio4

    Face it the C300 produces damn nice footage. It's amazing, but it's not worth $20K. No 1080 60P , Only 8 bit 422 out. Internal codec 50Mb/s 422. Why not the 100Mb/s Intra that has been one of the pro forms.

    Just another marketing shortcoming to entice you out of more $$ on their next release. The F3 offers 10bit 444.

  • MimirsanMimirsan

    @DrDave I am seriously considering the G10. Is it really that good in lowlight? Ive been stung before with poor lowlight with camcorders (had a tm700 for a while)

  • DrDaveDrDave

    I think wait and see what the new cameras bring. Right now, I wish there was a camera that was GH2 plus G10 together. Also, low light is not great on these cams, it is just that the GH2 is more-not-so-great. We could of course be disappointed. If Canon makes a camera that is better than 5D mk II, well, that would be presumably be very good in low light. Also I have always like Fuji sensors since say the F31fd. Maybe Fuji will produce the rabbit. Right now my solution is to just keep adding more lighting. The main reason I like the Pro CMOS sensor is the rendering of edges. Just a little bit smoother. But then you miss the GH2 sharpness....so I want it all, please!

  • PixCanFlyPixCanFly

    IMHO, I think people are unrealistic to expect a camera to do everything and worse, to dictate how much manufacturers should price their camera for :)
    So if low light is not the strength of GH2, bring some lights to the shoot, and vice versa, if you don't want to carry lights to a shoot, then buy another super duper low light camera then.

  • AriaAria

    It's funny but the 5DmkII was kind of a slip up by Canon. They didn't intend for it to be as good as it was video wise so that it stepped on the toes of the Pro Vid dept. and the GH series IMO also kind of bit the Pro Video Dept. in the butt. It's so good that it blurs the line between it and their big AF100. I wonder if anyone will ever have such a happy mistake like that again?

    I doubt that now that these companies are aware of the market that they'll let us get a freebie with a camera that punches above it's weight like that again. Maybe i'm wrong, but I get that sense. Look at the Sony Alpha and NEX series. While the video is pretty good, they made sure not to make it TOO good. IMO the only chance we have is Nikon. They're the only ones with no Pro Video skin in the game. No reason not to put their best video features in their DSLR's, cuz that's all they sell. Curious about the D4 and subsequent Nikon's to come.

  • markussenmarkussen

    the next model doesnt have to be better performing or better equipped.... observe the other Lumix G modells devellopment, they are rather less pro oriented, have small positive adjustments, but rather smaller housings and less manual controls, reusing censors, gaining profit for the producer in different segments.. and Panasonic did it before... introducing the NV-GS500 with less manual controls as succeedor to the NV-GS400, and opening the gab between consumer and pro cameras! I will not expect the GH3 to be offering substantial better performance, more man. controls or better interfaces like XLR/headset than the GH2 do, I rather expect it to be introduced to a lower price with lower production cost/less interfaces to give better profit in, as well the DMC class ( large quantities), as in the pro series, opening the gab between consumer and pro/prosumer segments again. The normal consumer will already now have a hard time to handle the options of the GH2, and the quality/performance offered from the camera even without hack is an overkill It is plentyfold documented that the GH2 is more than good enough for most purposes, it offers an unbeatable relationship between price and performance, and the limiting parameter is NOT the camera.... mostly it is the person behind and the story or missing story.... Always have fun telling YOur story.....

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