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GH4 Firmware 2.3, V-log for $99, Epic Panasonic marketing fail
  • 1451 Replies sorted by
  • nobbystylusnobbystylus

    @driftwood - intriguing stuff!

  • balazerbalazer

    Thank you, @driftwood. I'm eager to have your feedback. I'd suggest starting with the Cinelike D LUTs. Feedback I've gotten so far is that color accuracy is better in Cinelike D.

    And thanks, @Dr_Jon, for those test files.

    I've posted a new version of my log LUTs for Cinelike D and V-Log L. Now you can use any luminance range setting in Cinelike D (0-255, 16-235, and 16-255), and the LUTs are now in Adobe Cube format and DaVinci Cube format.

    And Dr_Jon, from your files I discovered that the GH4's Cinelike D output is using xvYCC encoding. That was a surprise to me. I'll post more about that later. The new LUTs will decode xvYCC from Cinelike D.

  • Dr_JonDr_Jon

    @balazer Firstly many thanks for all your efforts, this is proving a really interesting journey we're on. My current feeling is still I'll stick to Cinelike-D (I have always seemed to be in a minority who actually like it), that is unless Panasonic do something about the posterisation in VLog-L AND make a better overall solution. I do think your LUTs will hopefully be the way to start out grading a clip either way.

    I had a quick play with 1.3 and a couple of my VLogL/Cinelike-D samples from a bright day and the reds seem a bit intense - that might just be me or my clip of course (I was guessing a bit on exposure as it was an early experiment with VLogL)?

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    When you go into post with that log image and grade it back to a viewable contrast, you’re essentially stretching those 160 levels out to full a 255-level image (actually, it’s even worse; remember you have an extra stop of information, so to match the “normal” original you’ll stretch some of the log image into “superwhite” territory above 255 or “superblack” territory below 0, ignoring any S-curving you might do to preserve that information. And yes, I’m using full-range, 0–255 images as my common reference for this discussion). Put another way, you’re boosting the contrast of the log image by about 50% on average to get it back to a “normal” image.

    Two artifacts typically result from such stretching: more visible banding in gradients, and a boosting of noise.

    http://www.provideocoalition.com/v-log-l-on-the-gh4-don-t-panic

  • Dr_JonDr_Jon

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev Nice link, thanks, helped explain a couple of things about reds...

  • giulix99giulix99

  • driftwooddriftwood

    This was always an interesting link too as it applies to any cineon style LOG profile like V Log. http://www.xdcam-user.com/2014/03/understanding-sonys-slog3-it-isnt-really-noisy/

  • Dr_JonDr_Jon

    @driftwood - my issue with GH4 VLog-L was really just the lack of levels in 8-bit internal recording (using only 160-ish) giving posterisation effects (aka banding). Especially on nice blue skies. Do you feel there is a good work-around for that? (I currently find using balazer's LUTs on Cinelike-D footage to be a better approach, if you want to go via log, as I hate re-shooting stuff, assuming that is even possible.)

  • driftwooddriftwood

    @Dr_Jon I think you're probably better off going down @Balazer route for 8-bit in my honest opinion - use Cinelike D with his LUTs. As to V-Log, its 422/10-bit external recorder all the way I would recommend, though you can get some brilliant looking mid to close-ups (we're talking skintones here) sans skies internally. Horses for courses :-)

  • Brian_SianoBrian_Siano

    I haven't acquired the v-log enhancement yet, so I have a question. When you use v-log, how are the image's values shown on the histogram? Does the histogram display a squeezed range, where all values are in a narrow region? Or does it stretch the image's values across its full width?

  • nobbystylusnobbystylus

    @Brian_Siano once you've 'paid' for V-Log the histogram shows you 'squeezed' - i.e. a tall peak of very un-contrasty image. Seems to be sensible to make that 'peak' move as far to the right as possible without clipping to get the 'cleanest' image. Generally, exteriors look awesome to me - maybe apart from skies.

  • soulkeepersoulkeeper

    @balazer what about the gamut for vlog-l?did you come to any conclusions?

  • balazerbalazer

    @soulkeeper, yes, I measured the gamut of V-Log L. It's smaller than V-Gamut. I don't think it's any standard kind of gamut. It just seems that they did not calculate the internal raw-to-V-Gamut matrix very accurately. Perhaps they were not concerned with V-Gamut and they were just trying to make images look good with the V-Log-to-V709 LUT.

  • Brian_SianoBrian_Siano

    @nobbystylus Thanks. That's good to know: it makes it easier to do the overexpose-by-two-stops trick. Looking for3ard to using it.

  • lmackreathlmackreath

    Filmconvert GH4 Vlog film pack now available for download!

    http://filmconvert.com/download/Download_camera_packs.aspx

    had a quick play and looks good, good rendition of colours

    quick grab of kodak 5207, no other chnages

    ee.jpg
    3840 x 2160 - 2M
  • olli66olli66

    just downloaded the filmconvert pack, too I wish the DELUTs pack would have a description and/or much less LUTs I just don't find the motivation to test hundreds of LUTs... can anyone tell some favourites?

  • nobbystylusnobbystylus

    Film Convert seems nice - albeit a bit 'brown'.

  • MikeLinnMikeLinn

    https://www.facebook.com/ThomasSchweighoferFilm

  • VeskuVesku

    @MikeLinn

    In that New Zealand video I see odd colors (red clouds), massive banding in skies and blown highlights. Why using V-log if the result is so bad?

  • SoupertrooperSoupertrooper

    @Vesku It's really not that bad if you get your exposure right. Otherwise V-Log l seems to be catered to people who use external recorders.

  • nobbystylusnobbystylus

    I definitely think in shooting situations where you are filming faces, people, mids and CUs V-Log gives amazing clean results with lovely colour using ETTR. Where you are doing landscapes, you've got to be a bit careful with banding in the sky.

  • PierreBPierreB

    I think the red clouds were as a result of the sun bouncing off them....not vlog!...I see red clouds all the time, especially if there's any smog present in the air...

  • AlexauwaAlexauwa

    I am from germany and need vlog l for a project next monday. What is the fastest way to get it?

  • jopereirajopereira

    Next monday? "Legal" and all? Not possible.

  • Dr_JonDr_Jon

    Legal - rent/buy a GH4R... or V35, or choose an alternate camera with log capabilities.

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