@Bwhitz and @allthepeoplefromthisthread

I think the void is entering the discussion. Detail artefacts are part of the digital process. I understand the frustration based on some expectations maybe some specs didn't live to the word, but we have now a very capable camera that has 4k In a 4/3 amazing lowlight sensor. who would imagine this could be achieved at those sensitivities.

In a way I'm very glad that we have the opportunity to live use and watch the evolution of such grate machines. The GH series has gone very far and it is in a inacurate state of limbo, since is very pro capable but still consumer oriented. That makes professional confused, since they have prolike specs at low prices but lack of real control. Not that much far from a red camera in fact. We only lack raw material from gh5.

About the halos and artifacts the mud or the alliasing, they are part of the character of the camera and to that extend As a professional I'm able to overcome its limitations creatively. It's just a tool. And there are lots of them around.

In general I like what gh5 series offer. Has come a long way to what it is now.

The ideal situations would be buy both as panamarketing thought from the begining. Do you really think they don't have the knowledge to make the s line better? In fact only a firmware update could change all its behaviour completely.

Don't brag about its features, and implementation, see the way to overcome them in the best possible way

I'm in a current state of doubt. I have 30k+ to invest in editing machine and gear. 10 or such in amd thread ripper or Epyc workstation 8k ready and the rest on smart buy equipment. C200 ,eva1 ,ursaminipro, 2xgh5 , c300mk2, but to be real and honest I want a varicam Lt. Even second used, That is my dream more than an alexa mini or any camera at the moment. It feels right.

that image from gh5 it is not designed to be on set with its bigger brothers, that's a marketing strategy and lies, that makes you think GH series share parts with varicam series, like color and fake dual.gain sensor, its utter lies. Approaching consumers with professionals work.

Gh5s and gh5 is better that any camera at that price point on video. That's it, no more apples to oranges. Untill Sony comes with a Better aproach or the nx2 or whatever makes it 10 bit 422 at 400mbit 60p DCI, GH series is better from codec implementation to features.

6k anamorphic !! Come on bro!! For 2k!!!!???

Cheers

@endotoxic

I think the void is entering the discussion. Detail artefacts are part of the digital process. I understand the frustration based on some expectations maybe some specs didn't live to the word, but we have now a very capable camera that has 4k In a 4/3 amazing lowlight sensor. who would imagine this could be achieved at those sensitivities.

That's true. I agree with most of your whole post. But, on the other hand... there are cheap cameras that don't seem to have digital-artifacting. The Blackmagics for one, they all seem to render very nice, filmic, detail. Sure, the 2.5k are kind of old now, and a bit grainy... but, damn, I can't say they look digital. Still a very organic image free of artifact-ed details (maybe not the Pocket cam). I've even had 4k Blackmagic footage that looked better than the Alexa under the right lighting (since Alexa wasn't actually 4k)... so it can be done.

But, hey, like I've been saying... I could still be wrong. I'm just calling things as I see them currently. We haven't seen a whole ton of GH5s footage yet... there are allot of variables from shooting to uploading. So I'm gonna keep my eye on it! Cause it is a really amazing camera still with great features. Both the GH5 and GH5s are. I just really wanted that smooth, cinema-detailed look. It's what I really like for my projects. Not everyone needs to share my preference though.

@DrDave

the "horse" video on my monitor--the green looks like astroturf. Maybe that's the look they wanted but I wouldn't have pushed it that far (using the Spider Pro for calibration).

Yea, the colors aren't great. I was just using that as an example of pretty good-looking detail. Not sharp... but highly detailed and smooth.

but to be real and honest I want a varicam Lt.

Yes! The Varicams are one of my favorite cameras right now as well. Very awesome footage from those. Speaking of the Varicam... let's use it as a reference for amazing detail! Look how deep and clean that image resolves... damn! It's looks like photoraw-mode from a DSLR...

This is a decent video. If you are not filming above 25,000 ISO the A7R III is a nice balance of color and detail. The weird greenish tint of the Panasonics is a bit off putting, but the 5s is way better than the 5 in that regard.

@bwhitz

" Speaking of the Varicam... let's use it as a reference for amazing detail! Look how deep and clean that image resolves... damn! It's looks like photoraw-mode from a DSLR... "

It's true, but why it jumps like that? Movements are horrible. Can you please explain me why? And how to avoid it?

@ bwhitz

At 0:35 for example, the red bus on the bridge going left, or the woman at 0:46 walking to right. The movement stops for a tiny fraction of second then there is a very little jump forward.

@DrDave Yep, I was just gonna say that was probably it...

Dpreview sample images:

https://www.dpreview.com/samples/0852933368/panasonic-lumix-gh5s-sample-gallery

[VK - added photo]

@bwhitz

The Varicam is certainly not as detailed-rich as the GH5s when it comes to the video you show. That being said, the Cinematographer clearly has a clue of what he's doing compared to a lot of GH5/s stuff which are done by VLogers on their vacation trip or approximate testing. You're comparing Panasonic commercial who hired a director/dp/colorist/.../ with the next kid buying this camera to do unboxing videos and travel reviews.

Lastly, if you purely compare the two, here are things have noticed in the Varicam commercial and are absent in most GH5/s videos (and which are clearly known to create sharpness): 1) Chromatic Aberration, such a "mistake" in optic create sharpness, especially when it's thin. The reason is simple, it underline every lines and create micro-contrast. Compared to the overused Panasonic / Leica everyone use which are surgically soul-less (small distortion, vignetting, invisible chromatic aberration) 2) Colors, the color Grading in that video you posted is Great (because a colorist went through to make it look great), in many GH5/s stuff, people just apply a LUT and think "ok it's good now" while these camera can be used for VLoging, they usually need deep care in post-production workflow to be dealt with (and it's even worse with people shooting nowadays in Logarithm for every movie and start color grading straight without using Color Management making all their effort to waste) This is IMO the biggest killer that makes a lot of footage non-cinematic (or not-Red not-Arri like footage if you prefer). Chances are if you buy / rent a red or Arri, you don't use it for snapchat and have knowledge of the beast while if you do for the GH5, there's no guarantee the majority doesn't buy this product to shoot pictures of their dogs 3) Framing which orientates the eye to make things pop up and others to disappear. 4) Lighting, sounds about right since light deposit and shades create contrast, underline some parts of the frame.

Then yes, there are things that comes to the realm of taste. I still love the texture / color my GH2 produce anytime compared to the GH4/GH5/GH5s. It's certainely not natural but it's to my taste (to be fair if you take a look at it, nature sucks most of the time. It's grey, averagely saturated and chances are in your city the lights are cheap not of quality).

It's easy to find bad examples:

Just test a camera to see if it fits your needs, don't judge over the internet.

@bwhitz - why not buy a Sony alpha series camera instead? It’s a big ask for a significantly sub 2k camera to produce anything like the footage that a red, an arri, a varicam or even an fs7 produces

I use a GH4 (with it's much criticised 8 bit 4:2:0 4k H264 format) in multi-camera setups with Sony FS7, RED & BMD cameras and have never had a client notice. I'm sure you can see the difference, but my paying clients are extremely happy and love the finished, graded product.