@mastroiani

Personally, I would recommend to use one of these settings:

Cluster-X Spizz Trial 4 (bkmcwd)

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/106865#Comment_106865

direct download: http://www.personal-view.com/talks/uploads/FileUpload/5f/0b44b9591dee8a987d849615f7cebc.zip

cards tested:

24H & HBR modes:

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB - stable

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 8GB - not stable

720p50:

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB - stable

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB - not stable

Spanning: 24H & HBR modes successfully tested on SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB & SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB. SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB failed. 720p50 not yet tested.

Spizz utilzes around 50-65M on average in HBR/25p and FSH/50i mode. Around 130M in 24H mode.

Cluster-X Nebula Trial 6b

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/116992#Comment_116992

cards tested:

24H & HBR & 720p50:

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB - stable

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 8GB - not stable

Spanning: 24H & HBR modes successfully tested on SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB & SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB. SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB not yet tested. 720p50 not yet tested.

Nebula utilzes around 40-45M on average in HBR/25p and FSH/50i mode. Around 80-90M in 24H mode.

Cluster-X DREWnet Trial 8

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/116993#Comment_116993

Personally, I've slightly modified the setting to stabilize it in HBR/25p mode:

PTools -> Testers -> GOP related -> 1080i50 GOP Table=1, 4, 4, 1, 22, 22

cards tested:

24H & HBR & 720p50:

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB - stable

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB - not stable

Spanning: 24H & HBR modes successfully tested on SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB & SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB. SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB not yet tested. 720p50 not yet tested.

DREWnet utilzes around 35-40M on average in HBR/25p and FSH/50i mode. Around 80M in 24H mode.

You can also take a look at GOLGOP3-13 A2 Beta6

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/116896#Comment_116896

cards tested:

HBR mode:

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDXC 64GB - stable

• SanDisk 95MB/s SDHC 32GB - stable

• SanDisk 30MB/s SDHC 16GB - stable

24H and 720p50 not yet tested.

Since the latest revision of GOLGOP3-13 is pretty new I haven't tested it thoroughly yet ...

For documentary work I think Nebula Trial 6b will do fine.

@towi @driftwood Thanks a lot. What do you think of Xluster X Slipstream?

I don't really get the final difference between these patches. Is there anything really specific about them that I should know?

Thanks

Thanks. I read and understood the technical differences. I'm interested in the real world perception of these patches. Just a normal language, if such is possible. All of these patches are either great or superb, so in essence if you were to tell me that there is really no perceptible difference to the viewers I'd just pick one according to it's data rate and go with it. If there is no visual/perceptible difference to the viewer then there would be no development of these patches. But that's not the case. There is a difference and that's why they are developed.

For someone, who is not initiated in the technical lingo all of this jargon can be quite hermetic. All I wanted to know if your perception vis-avis the differences between these patches. That's all.

Thanks again for your hard work. Without you we wouldn't be where we are.

@mastroiani

It is hard to give such simplified explanations because many times it depends on your shooting scenario and preferences. Some settings are more "specialized" like those ones that use the GH3 matrix and footage has some character of the GH3' footage, some settings you want to use if you have lot of details in your shots, some are better for dark keeping blacks cleaner, some emphasize details and some sharpness. Also, there is a big stability and spanning issue, and it depends on your cards, and your needs again. Intra or long gop, 24 or 25p, better details for 720p or smoother slow motion, grading, and so on, and so on.

So, this is why everyone asks for direct plain explanation of what each setting does, and this is why there is no such thing, simply to many variables.

But, all of the settings are initially explained by their authors, extensively tested and many individual experiences are shared on their dedicated topics, so it's not like picking one in the dark, just watch videos that users share, and if you like some settings, give it a try, and report back if you have a problem.

Also you will most certainly get a detailed answer for a specific question for specific settings, on a dedicated topic.

@inqb8tr

It is hard to give such simplified explanations because many times it depends on your shooting scenario and preferences

True!

Then again the initial post is about 25p. IMO we do not have a wide range of settings to choose from when you have to (or want to) shoot 25p/50i.

I absolutely do admire the work of @driftwood on Intra settings and I have learnt a lot from him. Unfortunately 24p and 50i is coupled in the GH2's firmware and this is why you can't set a different GOP for 24p and 25p. But 25p Intra requires to set a really low 50fps frame limit. Frame size is below 500K... and therefore highly detailed scenes look totally compressed (just like with the All-I settings in the GH3 ... which are ridiculous, to say it in a friendly way... I can't wait for the first Intra hack/setting of @driftwood for the GH3 ...).

For 24p only I almost always use one of @driftwoods Intra settings (Sedna A AQ1, Intravenus and recently Moon). For max image detail on static scenes with 24p I prefer to use 3GOP settings (GOLGOP and recently Spizz). But quite often I do have to shoot in 25p/50i ... but also want to use a setting that works great in 24p at the same time for B-Roll (video only) shots to import into a 25p timeline. The only settings that really meet these requirements and work satisfactorily for me are Sanity V3 (very old setting), Valkyrie (both 444 and Cinema Smooth), GOLGOP, Spizz and Nebula. Well... I've also used a modified version of FlowMotion developed by @LPowell for a while. But since he has forbidden me to post my revised version for PAL users I've stopped talking about FloMo at all. FlowMotion is dated anyway since GOLGOP and Spizz are so much better in all modes (IMO). So since the choices are pretty limited for 25p I think it's pretty easy to give simplified advice in this particular case ...

... IMO

SPIZZ and NEBULA are the best patches for my case, especially since they have lowest GOP settings

not quite. Spizz is 3GOP, Nebula is 6GOP. Intra settings are 1GOP ... so the shortest GOP possible (1 frame).

from what I understood in your post, you prefer to use patches with lower GOP (GOLGOP and SPIZZ) for static scenes

for max. detail in 24p I prefer those 3GOP settings. But mostly I use Intra settings for 24p.

3GOP for brighter scenes with larger DOF - Intra for low key scenes with narrow DOF on tabletop-style shots.

Does that mean they re not as good for motion or moving camera?

not at all! Read the headline of driftwood's respective posts about the patches ("pro motion" / "best motion"). With regard to motion with 25p (!) I think the Valkyrie settings are clearly the smoothest (especially Valkrie 444 - http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/111829#Comment_111829 ). But Spizz is damn close. From the benchmarks the latest revision of GOLGOP should also produce really good motion (large B frames)... but I haven't had the time to test it yet.

I'd be interested to know both in case of 24P and 25P

don't worry about 24p. All these setting are fantastic in 24p with static scenes as well as with motion. Since 25p derives from low bitrate 50i it's really, really hard to make a good setting. Thanks to @driftwood and @bkmcwd we have a handfull of settings that look really good in 25p ... (to be fair: FlowMotion -at least my revised version - also looks really good in 25p, but it tends to produce compression artefacts on fine details sometimes).

Now, all that might sound a bit complicated and awkward. The reality is that you don't have the time to change settings when under time pressure. So this is what I do...: as all around setting for 25p I use Spizz or Nebula (Nebula - or even Sanity V3 - when I have to worry about card space. Well, I have plenty of cards, however I am a security fanatics ... I also carry a second copy of everything when I shoot a job. For personal work it's different, of course).

Or - to make it very short - I load Spizz as my to go setting for everything. Only for specialized purposes I load other settings ... I always carry 4 cheap and slow 2MB cards with 4 settings on them (Spizz, Nebula, Valkyrie, GOLGOP). On my laptop I have all my favorite settings and PTools ... so I can load any other setting pretty quickly. We've just used my GH2 as a kind of Gopro cam for a TV event production in low light (ISO800) with Spizz and it spanned 10 4GB files without issues. I would not have used Spizz if I would not trust it ...

Of all the settings mentioned above Spizz constantly produces the lowest QP on comparable scenes in 25p mode (even lower than GOLGOP). So from the technical benchmakrs Spizz should be superior (again: I am referring to 25p here!). Nebula on the other hand produces much larger I frames than Spizz ... so in good lighting Nebula should be superior (theoretically). In practice you won't notice any real difference between Spizz and Nebula... take one of these two and you'll be happy. Really!

@LPowell

I designed and tested Flow Motion v2 for GH2 users who are looking for a single, unified fast action patch that covers all the GH2 bases without requiring further testing and development on the user's part.

That's cool. Only FlowMotion either crashed my camera in 25p mode or produced mosquito noise on highly detailed scenes with sharp lenses. This is why I've modified the 50fps modes (esp. the frame limit) of FloMo. And my modified version runs trouble-free in PAL modes (at least on SanDisk 95MB/s cards). Too bad other users won't have access to these settings ... ;-)

@inqb8tr

Ok, not a thread, but simplified explanation. Apologies :)

no worries!

@LPowell

I thought you gave up on this vendetta after producing nothing tangible to back up your highly personal claims.

I don't think that my camera takes something "personal". It either works ... or not. With your latest version of FloMo it does not. What's the problem? Actually I thought this forum is about the exchange of experience and knowledge...

Trollwi

asshole! I'm not a troll. Never have been. Just reporting about my experience with your setting. It doesn't work in 25p mode. That's all. No reason to feel offended nor to be insulting. Buy better lenses and test it again ...

@LPowell

since I am not a native speaker I don't get the meaning of that phrase in this context ...

Who cares... let's leave it at that (or switch to PM ... but don't expect any reply from me)

@towi hi towi, sorry just another question. Is 25P on GH2 native or is it still wrapped in 50i? When I check the files they say 25P, but does that mean it's native or wrapped in 50i? I know that previously it was only possible to shoot 25P in 50i wrapped, was wondering if anything has changed. Thank you very much

@towi Thank you towi !

@mastroiani - using flow motion 2.02 for 25p hbr filming - works reliably and gives me an image I really like. Never seen any mosquito noise..