GH2 - 2.5fps AVCHD 24h Timebuster/TimeHBusteR 2.0 settings - The day is not over!

foolio

@duartix - do you have a pre-merged Sanity 5 + TimeBuster? I'm not sure if the one I created is working properly. a 3 minute test timelapse done on 24p was 240meg - seems too large?

duartix

@foolio That's around 12MBps, which for a 2.5fps shutter is indeed rather high as it should be a little under 6Mbps, however I'm wondering whether you are using the right mode. Are you sure you used the 24p base to merge and not the HBR base? If you need a 24p timelapser you'll be a lot better with Timebuster 2.0 Flow Motion than with Sanity.

tida

@parkgt I assume that you did follow instruction at http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/2232/different-times-at-one-location-extended-dynamic-range-solution-for-1080p-videos#Item_5

I usually use AvsPMod to create the script which you need for the AviSynth application. By means of the mentioned macro this avs-script will be located in the same directory of the mts-file and has similar naming. Takes less than 1 minute to generate and adjust script.

What I prefer next is to load this file into MeGUI and generate by this an mp4-file. Rendering of an 1hour timelapse takes less than 5 minutes with a 2600k 7i/GTX 570. Also you can work meanwhile on a new avs-timelapse-script.

This mp4-file you can use for vegas pro. If you work with vegas it's then important to match the same framerate of your project. Otherwise vegas will blend frames in addition.

That means workflow is very short (less than 6 minutes for 1h timelapse), you know what you did also after years as documentation via avs-file in same folder with similar name took place. You need: AviSynth, AvsPmod and MeGUI

Sorry I'm also at the moment short on time but in the next few days I will update a simple AvsPMod-macro file only for 2.5fps timebuster (24p) purpose. Current version does not include the first frame delete function which you need for timebuster.

Merino

@duartix

I'm really confused how you guys are getting this to work. I've been trying to follow your workflow from p1 point by point but not getting any good results. Been trying both the 24H Timebuster 2.0 and 24H Timebuster Flowmotion 2.02 patches. Tried shutter speeds of 1/5, 1/2,5 and 1/2.

First of all Streamparser is showing me not only I-Frame's (frame 0, frame 11, frame 21, etc) but also B and P frames (unlike your example on p1 which contained only I-frame's. Furthermore my I-frames contain increadibly bad artifacts and they are not clear images.

Secondly I do not understand your VirtualDub workflow. After loading the video in vdub you give two options (a; decimate by 12 and b speed up to 300fps) of which only 1 can be selected yet I don't understand the difference between these options. Neither is giving me good results either.

Anyone willing to give me a better, fullproof, workflow step-by-step that will make this all work?

duartix

@foolio , @Concordia, @nomad & @Merino : Good news! I gave it some extra though and I believe I might have fixed it for use with FlowMotion and possibly other non Intra settings that use B-Frames (like Cluster). A quick and dirty test showed everything working as it should with 24p in timeHBusteR.

I had to quit messing with the 24p GOP length and loose the 1/5s shutter flexibility though. I'll be uploading it tonight. If you are in a hurry, just use the base variant and uncheck 24p GOP length before merging. That's all there is to it.

@Merino : My VDub workflow might be flawed. I'm not sure either about VDubs's options but I reckon one of them does frame blending and the other does frame dropping (don't ask me which is which). IF you really want to use VDub, you should follow @tida 's workflow.

A simple and almost bulletproof workflow (earlier in this thread) is to use AE: http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/49325#Comment_49325

parkgt

@tida thanks for your reply. I am getting closer. I reloaded the Haali splitter used AvsPmod to generate a script that MeGui accepted; but when played the resulting mp4 file all I had was a black screen.

I think that I missed something with the interval setting in AvsPmod, I did set the GOP to 10 for 2.5 ss and deleted the extra line as advised.

So close now, I am very excited to put to use all this hard work everyone has done.

Thanks to all that have given so much time to make the GH2 and the hacks so incredibly capable.

Merino

@duartix

Tnx for all the help and the great work. Still a question though, using @tida 's workflow and the base Timebuster2.0 (unchecked GOP) merged with Flowmotion 2.02 what is the recommended Shutter Speed when recording, and what is the GOP setting when using @tida 's macro?

Merino

A little update after some testing, merging the base with Flowmotion 2.02 sets the GOP at 3. This seems imcompatible with SS of either 2, 2.5 or 5. What are the SS and GOP settings (both for the patch and the avs macro) I need to use?

duartix

@foolio , @Concordia, @nomad and @Merino

I'm growingly regretting to have tampered with the 24p GOP length just to add some flexibility and providing an extra 5fps timelapsing mode, which until the latest releases didn't adversely affected 24p. It has generated confusion amongst users, mode breaks and general mayhem.

@all:

IMPORTANT!

THE MAIN purpose of timeHBusteR is giving you a default matching GOP for 2.5fps which must used with HBR30. This means setting your camera to NTSC mode before timelapsing!!! I should have probably have been more clear about that, and I won't forget to update the Doc and general instructions. As an extra, a 5fps matching GOP was also given to be used with HBR25. Because most developers are using the new GOP parameters recently, it was that extra that broke 24p and won't be coming back in future releases, so timeHBusteR will not change the GOP length of the 24p mode any more.

I'm including an alpha version of timeHBusteR 2.02.1 which, if all goes well, will be released unchanged soon with proper documentation to accompany. I've given it a very quick and dirty test and everything came out as expected.

Please let me know your findings. Don't forget that timelapsing with the timeHBusteR variant must be done with the camera in NTSC mode (HBR30). 24p should be fully preserved and this is what should be tested. Don't bother using HBR25 for timelapsing because it is inherently broken by definition since GOP3 and GOP6 (the most common definitions for 24p on most mergers) don't serve any timelapsing shutter speed in HBR25 (as seen here: http://www.personal-view.com/talks/uploads/FileUpload/1b/535dfdee7a15f106829ebcaf14c4b6.png ) For obvious reasons (intentionally trashed frames) HBR25 shouldn't be used for regular footage either.

I'm also sorry to have been a little absent on the boards and on settings support these last few weeks, but it was a well deserved vacation.

duartix

@Merino:

Regarding your last post, the GOP3 is inherited for 24p from FlowMotion 2.02. If you are using timeHBusteR, you need to use HBR for timelapses. Not only that but you need to specifically use HBR30 and NOT HBR25.

HBR25 is broken by nature! It uses the wrong GOP for timelapses (because it's a tuned GOP for 24p) and bad frames (tuned for timelapsing). HBR25 gets the worst of two worlds and thus won't serve any use, be it timelapsing or regular footage.

To sum it up: Set your camera to NTSC for timelapsing when using timeHBusteR.

parkgt

@duartix Does your statement "To sum it up: Set your camera to PAL for timelapsing." apply to both Timebuster andTimeHBusteR? I had thought Timebuster was fine in NTSC mode?

Merino

@daurtix I'll be trying timeHBuster next. Also I thought 25p was actually PAL (in 50i wrapper) and 30p was NTSC (60i wrapper).

I also just made a timelapse vid using the GOP3 24p merge with SS of 1/8th and it actually had a pretty good result after throwing it through @tida 's macro. Still very confused on how all of this works so I guess the only way is to keep testing and trying it out more.

nomad

@duartix

Yes, I'm a bit confused too now. You wrote: " timelapsing with the timeHBusteR variant must be done with the camera in PAL mode (HBR30)." Isn't HBR30 connected with NTSC and HBR25 with PAL?

duartix

@parkgt: It applies only to timeHBusteR. I corrected it. Thanks.

@Merino: Both HBR25 and HBR30 are PsF (progressive captured PAL/NTSC but encoded as interlaced 50i/60i). This means that both fields of each frame are captured at the same moment unlike real interlaced capture.

@Merino: If you re going to use a different shutter speed (SS) that isn't the settings default 2.5fps, you should adjust the GOP length of the mode you are going to use, according to this table: http://www.personal-view.com/talks/uploads/FileUpload/1b/535dfdee7a15f106829ebcaf14c4b6.png in order to marry it to that SS. ^You should relate to the Documentation (1st topic) or follow these simpler instructions on tuning Timebuster/timeHBusteR (especially steps 8/9): http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/57152#Comment_57152 Otherwise you'll either end up with either too much I frames (wasting space) or too little I frames (not enough temporal definition to describe what you are capturing). 1/8s isn't an interesting SS either, as it isn't FLUID in any mode (it's close at 95% in HBR30, but not there).

If you don't know apriori which SS you are going to use, then you shouldn't use any timebuster settings because they are tuned to give you extra recording length (or extra IQ optionally) for a very specific SS.

duartix

@nomad: Well, apparently you are not as confused as I am. I keep doing that mistake. :(

You are right HBR25=PAL, HBR30=NTSC... I don't know why I keep slipping into this error...

A lot of posts to correct...

Thanks!!!

duartix

@parkgt: You were right, I confused PAL and NTSC in a previous post which is now corrected.

parkgt

I finally got it all to work, thanks to the many helpful post from duartix and tida.

It is nice to be able to do high quality time-lapses without wearing out the shutter.

duartix

@parkgt:

If you have enough light and don't mind giving away the continuous motion flow, you might also want to try the HSS (high shutter speed/40fps) mode with an intervalometer. It gives out 4MP stills (even though I have some doubts whether there is a serious resolution advantage or not over 1080p) and it doesn't wear the mechanical shutter either.

ethanpil

I know this is a silly question and doesn't really belong here... but, I have searched for almost 30 minutes and I cannot find the shutter speed adjustment while in video mode. Where do I change it?

duartix

@ethanpil:

In the easiest way, you need the camera to be on M movie Mode and you can change it on the wheel.

If you are in of the C modes you can also access it through the Q.MENU button.

NOTE: You will have to set the camera to MF to go below 1/25s (PAL) or 1/30s (NTSC) shutter speed.

tida

Attached AvsPMod macro will work with following options:

SourceFilename (has to be selected)

TargetFilename (preset SourceFilename.avs)

SourceFrameRate (detected from SourceFile)

TargetFrameRate (preset == SourceFrameRate)

GOP (preset 10)

StepSize (preset 1)

FrameControl (preset will delete 1st frame)

timelapse rate will result as: TimelapseRate = GOP x StepSize x SourceFrameRate/TargetFrameRate

Presets of GOP, StepSize and FrameControl is based on 2.5fps Timebuster patch. Copy the .py file into the macro folder of AvsPMod. Then you will find it when you start AvsPMod again updated in the menu "macro"

duartix

@tida: I wish there was a way to put a LIKE on your last post.

BTW, it's never enough to link the SS/GOP table.

cogumelo

I'm a newbie with the GH2, and the Timebuster is the third "settings pack" that I'm trying in my GH2, and to be honest, I'm quite happy.... Last weekend I went out to test the hack, and I did some quick timelapses using the kit lens 14-42, CPL, Fader ND and a GorillaPod... Most of the clips were recoreded using the 24p at 2.5 ss, and few shots using MJPEG 2fps.... In post I've used the Time remapping from After effects (stretching 10% and applying Frame Blending)...

Sorry for the bad editing, I just cut some shots, dragged a soundtrack and placed the clips together ....LOL

Thanks all users, testers and developers from www.personal-view.com... Great Job!

Timelapses in London - First tests with 24h Timebuster settings in my brand new old GH2 from Marco Zanqueta on Vimeo.

mee

Here are a couple time busters I did for Driftwoods Sunrise/Sunset competition. I Used Sedna AQ1 A max detail, and did things a bit different than most I suspect. I used in camera 300% both at 1/50th and 1/8th Film speed. Then sped the shots up even more in post. I really enjoy shooting time busters, and welcome any comments.

vstardust

@duartix I read these posts considering problems with Timebuster and Flowmotion 2.02, but I'm still a little bit confused wether I did understood it correctly or not, that the problem was (only) with TimeHBusteR and Flowmotion 2.02.

I'm using Timebuster 2.0 base merged with Flowmotion 2.02, so I'm using 24p for timelapses and HBR30 and 720p60 for regular shooting. Am I going to be safe with this merged patch? I don't have possibility to check my footage before I return back home.

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