@Meierhans

Don't worry: your communication is clear regardless of any technical glitches. :)

If by "atmo" you mean atmosphere, then I would have some reservations about using a shotgun mic. Using a stereo mic is generally helpful for that.

But for interviewing and documentaries, I think that the mic is suitable. The quality is quite sufficient for the purpose and it lets you do more with less (and in less time) than just about any other option.

If you're working from a script, it would really be helpful to have at least one other person assisting you with sound because it's a whole beast unto itself (and the standards are quite different from documentaries and interviews).

I don't personally think it's worth it to go "in-between" by adding pre-amps, etc. to the GH2 because you go through the GH2's analog to digital converters can't fully defeat the internal pre-amp and and pushing the input gain too much just ends up giving you distortion (like the +20db gain issues I mentioned on the VMP in an earlier post in this thread). Good digital recorders will have better converters and a lower noise level and often provide you with XLR inputs.

If you're going to upgrade your audio, I suggest having a second person run a digital recorder (like a Zoom, etc.) as opposed to messing about with anything in-between. If you spent an equal amount on both the respective options, the digital recorder alternative would result in a noticeably higher fidelity file.

Or hire a sound guy ? 90% of GV Cam mic footage is trashed in the mix generally, I wouldn't spend too much on a cam mounted mic (from a dubbing mixers point of view!) Far too many programmes are being delivered every day recorded very badly to the point of not being able to be passed on delivery (CEDAR aint cheap!) radio mics badly placed, badly handled boom recordings and not thinking of where to record basic stuff like interviews (dont sit under the aircon!) ruins some great filmed stuff because production cant be arsed to spend a little more on a sound engineer. It really cant be fixed in the mix - if its a turd - its just going to be a louder turd after the mix.

Thanks for the input. I was thinking about the Tascam ixz because it allows you to monitor the audio while recording and to level its output in a way the internal preamps can but set to their absolute minimum. Plus it has an additional mini jack input, so you can add a local battery powered mic for the second stereo channel. I though for 50 € thats quite nice - at least if the name tag still stands for something.

I can't comment much on the GH2 audio, since I just got my GH2 24 hours ago. But because I am an audio nut on a budget, plus I knew I would be getting this camera sooner or later I got the Zoom H1, and I realize the H3 is the goods, but the H1 really has surprised me. It also has a mini jack input, and the price is about the same at 9000 yen, or 100US. Very light weight, and true X stereo mics. It picks up sounds you didn't even know were there with amazing clarity. I did review the Tascam side by side, but it really seemed to me the Zoom had it beat. Anyways, just my 2 cents. Oh, and I recorded a friends concert with it which was a mix of ambient, techno, african beats, and traditional Japanese folk music, and it all sounded great with no distortion at all.

@soundgh2

Ah, then I can definitely understand feeling grumpy. :) It's really true, both how much money could be saved by properly training the people handling audio acquisition and how frequently the higher ups completely overlook the audio impact. It can be especially frustrating in light of all the research that has been done on the effect audio has on audience/listener response.

Manfred Clynes (not to be confused with Manfred Klein, the generous font designer) proved years ago that several of the "greatest" performances of the "greatest" classical pieces actually evoked a universal response (as measured in a highly controlled environment through body movement, etc.) REGARDLESS of culture. Just as interestingly, the response was no longer universal if the performance was 2nd tier OR if a 2nd tier composition was used. I wish I had a link ready, but if you're making a film and can put 2 and 2 together, that means you just learned a heck of a lot about reaching your audience.

Add that to research done during the 90s in computer games, when they did a controlled study of players going through tests with the LucasArts game "Dark Forces" and you see something else interesting. Players going through the game twice without having been told what had been switched cited several improvements: the game was faster, the graphics seemed better, etc. But in reality the ONLY thing that was changed between the two tests was the audio quality.

Nobuo Uematsu (the composer behind Final Fantasy and one of the 5 most widely performed composers in the industry) said at the Game Developers Conference in 2005 that the music was especially essential to early video games. "Did you ever play any of those games without the music? They were really boring." And the crowd laughed in recognition.

And finally, what about the famous Academy Awards show where they played the iconic scene from Chariots of Fire of several runners, running alongside one another on the beach? They played it first without the music (very little impact) and the once again with Vangellis soundtrack (suddenly you have the powerful scene that everyone remembered).

And yet music typically gets a paltry part of the project budget. The Japanese games in recent years had often been especially guilty of this. Keep in mind that the most recent Zelda game is the FIRST to feature a recorded orchestral score in the series and you start to get the idea of the way things had been going.

Then take a look at the opposite end of the equation. Heavy Rain, a video game that released last year, managed to become one of the top 20 best-selling PS3 games sold to date, one of only 5 that was an original IP. It also had one of the largest audio budgets (thanks to the auteur having previously worked as a composer) and recording sessions at a little place called "Abbey Road".

The direct emotional impact of things like that has a noticeable effect on the bottom line, and I say that not only as someone working in the music industry and that has done business consulting for several companies, but (just to clarify the reference point) as someone that has grown up consciously addressing these issues since the earliest points of verbal memory with someone that started or ran over 100 and companies (including several Fortune 500s) and was hired at the national level by English, Swedish and U.S. governments to apply that knowledge. In other words, there's no excuse from a business perspective for ignoring how important this issue is, even if someone understand the artistic one.

In other words, I think we ALL really feel your pain on that one. :)

Excellent posts @thepalalias, but you can write a mini guide to enchance the audio recording on the GH2 based on your great experience? They maybe cover the use of the onboard MIC, one external and a bypassed for a external recorder, providing the infamous AGC settings and bitrates... its a ambicious request yes, but im trying :)

Thx in advance.

Im currently using a Marantz PMD661 + Rode ntg-2

@LPowell I agree completely. I only mentioned "beyond 448kbps" because it's already possible in PTool. :) I did several recordings with the GH2 using 448kbps but then stopped because I could no longer delete video files in camera effectively (since the camera had trouble accessing them since it couldn't play them of course).

@thepalalias

I tried your setting with AT875R mic and USB Dual Pre. I set the preamp to +20 db input gain and +5 db output gain. BTW it's a cheap preamp. Some people say its preamp is as good as H4n.

AGC 3: 14 Too much noisy in-camera gain.
AGC 2: 36 Noticeable noisy in-camera gain.
AGC 1: 203 Almost no noisy in-camera gain!!!
AGC 0: 235 No sound.

I guess the magic number for my audio gears is around 203.

Then I set AGC 0 to 203. Nice and clean sound. In camera AGC is almost gone when it's quite. Actually I didn't hear any noise. If I need to boost sound, the preamp has more room to boost input and output. There is no need to tweak other AGC settings.

Great! Thanks!! Woohoo!!!

Hi @thepalalias Do you have any experience with the Sound Devices MixPre-D?

It has stereo unbalanced mic level (-36dBu) output to camera over a TA3. It's what we're looking at adding to our setup as everything reads good on paper, but I'd love to hear from someone in the know.

We want it so we have the option of recording directly to camera, or to recording device (H4n)

Get back to factory settings of the firmware and check out again...

I have a Roede Stereo VideoMic and I get the same result as @stonebat

AGC 3: 14 Too much noisy in-camera gain.
AGC 2: 36 Noticeable noisy in-camera gain.
AGC 1: 203 Almost no noisy in-camera gain!!!
AGC 0: 235 No sound.

The internal mic also sounds better with these settings
203 and 36 are my settings now Level 2 or 3

@thepalalias If I set AGC0 to 203 What is a good average for AGC1 between 203 and 36?

@thepalalias

Did a load of LucasArts early Star Wars Uk recorded stuff way back - fun!

Sat next to Mr Murch during Cold Mountain and chuckled as he turned off the DFC automation and made everyone play the sound per scene - guess what much better :) Boom ops are so underrated if they're good - makes a story sing ADR - for the artist and us fitting it never has :/

@soundgh2 Kudos - I have tons of great memories of old LucasArts projects as a young gamer and have enjoyed hearing anecdotes about the production of new projects from friends in recent years. :)